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Re: ‘Are we better off than four years ago?’ [Letter, Village News, 9/13/12]

Thursday, September 27th, 2012
Issue 39, Volume 16.
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As always Mr. Monday, your comments are a treasure.

As a country, are we better off than we were four years ago? Let’s see:

Our president, beginning in January 2008, has presided over the following:

Over 8 percent unemployment for 4 straight years

An international credit downgrade last year for the first time in our history

A national debt that has skyrocketed to $16T this year from $10T in 2008

Squandered $800B+ on a failed stimulus plan

Mr. Frank and Mr. Dodd caused the greatest housing crisis in our history

Our reputation as a world leader has been seriously compromised

Created a loathsome class warfare

Tried to "muscle" the Catholic Church to accept abortion and contraception at taxpayer expense

In addition, the value of family households has plummeted by 40 percent – $126K (2007) vs $77K (2010); the number of people on food stamps has risen from 27M (2008) to 71M (2012); the number of people on SS disability has risen from 8.1M (2007) to 9.8M (2012); the cost of welfare has jumped from $500B (2008) to $820B (2012) and there’s been an increase in the poverty rate from 12.3 percent (2008) to 15.1% (2010) – the highest level in 20 years. But as you say – I’m sure it’s all Bush’s fault!

I’m also sure you Dems are busy watching the slowing of the ocean’s rise and the planet healing, but take off a few minutes and read a newspaper.

Tom Conley



Comment Profile ImageJon Monday
Comment #1 | Friday, Sep 28, 2012 at 2:31 am
Hi Tom,

To say the least, you got a couple of facts wrong.

You said, "Our president, beginning in January 2008, has presided over the following…", while complaining about Obama's impact on the economy. But, he wasn't in office until a year after January 2008. And besides that, the government in 2009 was still operating on Bush's budget, not Obama's.

I know conservatives like to lay the poor economy and federal debt on Obama - but this is going too far. You can’t blame Obama for the last year Bush was in office, or the budget for 2009 that was Bush’s budget.

First of all, it was the "Trickle Down" economic theory combined with deregulation, and unpaid for programs that brought the US, and much of the world, economy to its knees.

Let's review - it actually started under Reagan with David Stockman's "Supply Side Economics" - a term he invented to hide what they called it inside the White House: "Trickle Down Economics", which Stockman knew would not play well with the majority of Americans. Bush I called it Voodoo Economics. The idea was to cut the tax rates to benefit the rich and corporations, and somehow, the economy will magically spring to life, IRS revenues will grow, and the economic benefit will trickle down to the middle class and poor.

It didn't work. It will never work. We are a consumer driven economy, and that requires that consumers have spendable income to drive the economy. Stockman eventually admitted the failure, and is currently publically renouncing the whole theory – which Romney embraces. Tax cuts and deregulations! Not again!

Bush II carried the idea off the cliff. With two unfunded wars, two unfunded tax cuts (meaning he didn't cut any expenses to offset them), and an unfunded Medicare Part D program. All of which Obama is still trying to pay for, while also dealing with the economic crash caused by Bush II.

So, Obama comes into office during the height of the worst financial crash since 1929, and narrowly averts another Great Depression, despite working under the Bush budget for the first year.

The only problem with the stimulus Obama proposed and pushed through Congress was that it was about a third or fourth of what was needed, according to most credible economists.

The bank bailout that happened under Bush II was supported by Bush, McCain, and Obama, as it was needed to avoid a second world-wide Great Depression. If you don’t think that’s a big deal, well, we live in different worlds (which may be true anyway).

You list a bunch of facts that may all be true, but then sarcastically say, “I’m sure it’s all Bush’s fault!” Well, you’re mostly right on about that. Much of it can be laid at the feet of Bush, but until the Republican Party says it publically (instead of just hiding Bush from public view, the convention, and campaign), and abandons Trickle Down, we still have a problem, no matter how good the economy gets – as it will always end in a crash.

Conservatives, especially Faux News, like to blame Dodd-Frank for the crash. That’s nonsense, and I’m not sure anyone actually believes it. The cause of the crash is not mysterious, but is complex. The housing bubble is just a small part of the cause. The real cause was the fall of Wall Street, brought on by the sudden realization by regulators, government, and the financial giants that unregulated instruments like CDOs were really worthless, despite their AAA ratings by the credit rating agencies.

An explanation of CDO can be found at:

The wizards of Wall Street figured out a way to bundle all kinds of debt into things that could be sold as securities. These are called Collateralized Debt Obligations, where thousands of all kinds of loans are grouped in such a way that they could be sold to investors.

The types of debt that went into CDOs include:

• Structured finance securities (mortgage-backed securities, home equity asset-backed securities, commercial mortgage-backed securities)
• Leveraged loans
• Corporate bonds
• Real estate investment trust (REIT) debt
• Commercial real estate mortgage debt (including whole loans, B notes, and Mezzanine debt)
• Emerging-market sovereign debt
• Project finance debt
• Trust Preferred securities

The big players hedged their bets with something called Credit Default Swaps – a kind of insurance on CDOs and other investment instruments. The main player in selling the “insurance policies” was AGI. They thought they had the best thing going. Major Wall Street players like Goldman Sachs, Lehman Brothers, and many others were placing what they thought was a no-lose game. AGI was collecting insurance premiums for what they thought was little risk, and everyone wins! Well, there’s no such thing as a no-lose game.

A credit default swap (CDS) is a financial swap agreement that the seller of the CDS will compensate the buyer in the event of a loan default or other credit event. The buyer of the CDS makes a series of payments (the CDS "fee" or "spread") to the seller and, in exchange, receives a payoff if the loan defaults.

A detailed explanation of CDS can be found at:

In part the article says, in Portfolio Magazine, Michael Lewis reported that "There weren’t enough Americans with [bad] credit taking out [bad loans] to satisfy investors' appetite for the end product." Essentially, investment banks and hedge funds used financial innovation to enable large wagers to be made, far beyond the actual value of the underlying mortgage loans, using derivatives called credit default swaps, collateralized debt obligations and synthetic CDOs.

While the size of the Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac issues added up to a few trillion, the worldwide size of the CDS problem was over $50 trillion – more than any government or group of governments could deal with. No one knew the problem was that big until the crash was underway, as they were unregulated. It came to light when ex-CEO of Goldman Sachs, Hank Paulson, decided to let Lehman Brothers go bankrupt – and the whole world melted down and financial markets came to a halt.

To stop the bleeding Paulson engineered a bailout, with the largest part going to AGI to pay off the CDSs. Then AGI turned around and paid off Goldman Sachs. Bush, Obama, McCain, and the Congress agreed to the bailout because they correctly saw that the crash of 1929 and the Great Depression were child’s play compared to what was coming.

But, all that’s water under the bridge. What do we take as a lesson from the experience is what is important. Do we look into the causes to determine what to do, or do we just blame Obama? The great unanswered question for Romney is, what policy differences does he offer that are different than the policies that insured the crash and recession?

Now, let’s look at how Obama is doing after three and a half years in office, compared to the recovery from the 1929 crash.

It took over three years after the 1929 crash before the stock market and unemployment hit bottom. The Dow Jones average was 381 at the 1929 peak, and hit bottom at 41 in late 1932. It didn’t get back to pre-crash levels until the 1950s.

The recent high water mark for the Dow Jones was 14,093 in October 2007, and it started falling badly until March of 2009 when it hit 6,626, a 12 year low. Without question, it was the biggest crash since 1929 – nothing else comes close.

Since that market low, a month after Obama took office, the Dow Jones has doubled, gaining back what was lost in the crash. A much stronger and faster recovery than the 1929 crash.

In the 1929 crash, the highest unemployment rate was in 1933, four years after the crash, when it was over 20% and stayed over 15% throughout most of the 1930s. Finally, the FDR stimulus programs, including the buildup for WWII, brought the rate down to 5% more than 10 years after the crash

The unemployment rate started going up in 2007, and after the 2008 crash peaked in October 2009 at 10%. After that, Obama’s policies have brought the rate steadily down to 8% - near the 7.5% it was when he took office. Of course, it would be even lower if Obama had any cooperation from Congress, but the Republicans would rather work to block Obama’s second term than help the country.

Historically, Reagan/Bush I doubled the national debt, Clinton actually lowered it during his time in office, and then Bush II doubled it again. Where were the conservatives then?

If you want to know where the national debt comes from, look at the chart on this page:

Reagan/Bush and Bush II are by far the real villains for exploding the federal debt. Until Reagan, our debt from WWII was steadily falling under each president for over 30 years. With Reagan’s first budget, which was the first time a president proposed a $100+ billion deficit, the debt climbed for 12 years, then Clinton brought it down, but Bush II took it to over $10 trillion, with a payment obligation for the next president (whoever was elected), that kept the debt on a steep incline.

Regarding class warfare, it’s been going on since 1981 – and the lower 90% of Americans have been the obvious and continuous loser. During that time, real household income has been level or dropped for most Americans, while the top 10% have greatly increased their wealth, especially the top 1% or top .1%. There has not been such wealth and income disparity since before the 1929 crash. It’s not healthy for a society. In other words, Obama didn’t start the class warfare; but we all should work to end the exploitation of American workers.
Comment Profile ImagePat
Comment #2 | Friday, Sep 28, 2012 at 1:07 pm
"You can’t blame Obama for the last year Bush was in office, or the budget for 2009 that was Bush’s budget."

YES WE CAN. President Obama signed the final FY2009 spending bills on March 11, 2009. President Bush did sign some appropriations bills and a continuing resolution to keep the government running into President Obama’s first term, BUT a Democrat controlled Congress purposely held off on the big spending portions of the appropriations bills until Obama took office. Bush signed only three of the twelve appropriations bills for FY 2009: Defense; Military Construction/Veterans Affairs; and, Homeland Security. President Bush also signed a continuing resolution that kept the government running until March 6, 2009 that level of funding the remaining nine appropriations bills at FY 2008 levels. Bush and his spending CAN only be credited on those three appropriations bills and FY 2008 levels of funding for the remaining nine appropriations bills. T
Make no mistake: Bush was a tremendous spender, and he deserves some of the non-credit for making Obama’s federal budget binge possible, especially during Obama’s first year. But Obama and his fellow Democrats share the responsibility for allowing a spending spike to continue on at newly high levels, for posting record outlays and running record deficits — and for taking few if any effective steps to get the nation’s economic and fiscal houses in order!
Comment Profile ImageMike W
Comment #3 | Friday, Sep 28, 2012 at 1:36 pm
Oh there you go again Jon Monday, trying to prove your point of view with calm, rational, verifiable information from honest, time consuming research, in a town and country where silly innuendos, half truths and outright lies reign supreme. Get a grip will ya ? lol... I love ya man, and I know I am not the only one here who appreciates your efforts to speak the truth in the face of such nasty, arrogant and ignorant accusations they throw at you here fro time to time. Please, keep on keepin on...

I was impressed with the way Obama ran such a clean campaign back when he was running for the nomination, even when even Hillary resorted to lies and the lowlife mudslinging of the GOP, and again when he ran for president. It's called integrity.
I do not agree with, nor do I understand many of his moves but I am still impressed with what he "has" done, especially in the face of such lack of support and so much opposition from his own countrymen.

Call me a hopeless optimist, but I believe he can and will use the knowledge he has gained from his last 4 years and his mistakes so far, to make bigger strides to help this country in his last four years. "if" we will stand up to our own responsibilities as Americans and get out there and make him do it by forming many strong grass roots organizations to help him push against corporate special interests and towards "our" needs during these trying times.
I thought everybody knew that complaining and mudslinging does nothing except extend our grief...

I may be wrong but I think it was FDR who, when approached by some citizens offering good ideas, said, "I think that is a great idea, now go out there and make me do it."

I think what he was saying was that even the president can not do some things he would like to do for this country, without our help.

P.S. For those of you protest voters who are not satisfied with Obama but would never vote for somebody like Romney. You do know this presidential race is between Obama and Romney, no one else is able to win, no matter how good a person they may be. You must know that voting for anyone other than Obama is as good as a vote for Romney and the new-conservatives hanging on his coattails who nearly tanked this country eight years ago... Think about it, Do you really want a snake in the grass like Karl Rove and friends in the white house again, pushing for war with Iran?
And another thing to think about for those of you who think Obama has no experience, He will have the experience of the last four years that Romney does not have. That's saying quite a bit when you "Think about it"
Comment Profile ImageVicki
Comment #4 | Friday, Sep 28, 2012 at 3:41 pm
Excuses aren't change. Vote Obama out. Disgrace shouldn't last another 4 years
Comment Profile ImageMike W
Comment #5 | Saturday, Sep 29, 2012 at 5:12 pm
Good thinking Vicki. How could anyone who knows where we were and where we were headed 4 years ago, and the speed we were traveling in that direction, could assume that one man could overcome that inertia and bring this nation back on course and flying right in just 4 years. This is a world wide situation, please show me a country that has, except Iceland
I'm pretty sure we all know that even a team of devoted scientist, scholars and geniuses couldn't do that. So go ahead and blame the president but you should also blame all the presidents men and ourselves.

Unfortunately, things of such magnitude like our economy and climate change will take a lot of time to correct, how long will it take us to get back to the air quality we had 40 years ago or even 20. Get real will ya ? I'm sure we all can see the relationship between our health and our atmosphere
The only disgrace I see is the barrage of half truths and lies coming from the right flooding the airways. There are phone banks working for Romney calling old folks telling them that Obama is gonna take away their Medicare, social security, turn the nation socialist and, by the way, he's a Muslim... Yikes !!!
Saying that the right has been against Obama since day one is no excuse and wasn't to be, it is a "fact" to be considered, nothing more.

P.S. July was the hottest month ever recorded in the Lower 48 states, the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration announced on Wednesday. Last month broke a record set during the Dust Bowl of the 1930s, according to records that go back to 1895.

"Call me a converted skeptic," Richard Muller wrote in a July 30 op-ed published by The New York Times. In a turnabout last year, the UC Berkley physics professor concluded that global warming was, in fact, occurring. Now, he wrote, "I'm now going a step further: Humans are almost entirely the cause." NASA's James Hansen also recently confessed error. "When I testified before the Senate in the hot summer of 1988, I warned of the kind of future that climate change would bring to us and our planet. I painted a grim picture of the consequences of steadily increasing temperatures, driven by mankind's use of fossil fuels. But I have a confession to make," Hansen admitted in The Washington Post. "I was too optimistic. My projections about increasing global temperature have been proved true. But I failed to fully explore how quickly that average rise would drive an increase in extreme weather."
Comment Profile ImagePink
Comment #6 | Sunday, Sep 30, 2012 at 1:18 pm
President Ronald Reagan cleaned up an even bigger mess created by Jimmy Carter back in 1980 AND he did it in only 31/2 years! It has been 4 years for Obama and he hasn't even made a dent in the mess we are in today.... he promised things would be better, instead they are much worse. He now says he needs more time because nobody could have done it in 4 years.... really? I wonder how much of Hillary's debt the DNC had to promise to pay off in order to get Bill Clinton to make that gag making speech at the convention. I mean we all know what a good liar Bill is ("I did not have sex with that woman") but I'll bet even he had to go throw up after he spoke. I don't doubt that lots of people want to believe Obama, and lots more keep hoping they will get that hand-out but if he gets re-elected our country will be a lot worse off in 4 more years then it is now (if that's even possible).
Comment Profile ImageBiden- ism #356
Comment #7 | Tuesday, Oct 2, 2012 at 5:25 pm
Today our joe proclaimed that"the middle class has "been burried for the past 4 years!!" Doesnt Joe know that he and his buddy have been in command for the past 4 years?? hahahaha
Comment Profile ImageMike W
Comment #8 | Wednesday, Oct 3, 2012 at 11:22 am
Pink, "President Ronald Reagan cleaned up an even bigger mess created by Jimmy Carter back in 1980, AND he did it in only 31/2 years!"

I don't think there is a time in history when the the US and the world has been in a bigger mess than we are today Pink, and I don't think we will ever work our way out of it by blaming one man and not the system itself and those who promote it.

Ask yourself why George Bush and Dick Cheney cannot leave the county for fear of being arrested for crimes against humanity ...
Ask why our government/system has a long history of supporting dictators and corrupt regimes that oppress their people and then turn around and murder those puppets when they become unwilling to play by the rules of the dollar and central banking.
Ask why our media is bent on promoting half truths and lies, scare tactics and vilifying Muslims while supporting a country engaged in the theft of ancestral land and the ethnic cleansing of its rightful owners.
Ask why we are paying for the construction and maintenance of over 800 manned military bases around the world (just since 9/11) who's only purpose is to protect multinational business interests that do not pay us back in kind, never have and never will.
Ask why business leaders and certain members of congress are permitted to write bills and establish laws in secret closed sessions that favor multinational business interests rather than the American people or the country we live in.

Changing presidents will not change much of anything, never has and never will. But looking at the whole system with eyes wide open and using common sense, just might.
Question, and take the time to find the answers to all your questions, instead of relying on the system to entertain you with a lie ...

Austerity doesn’t work..

Investigate and consider adopting the Iceland example

Wednesday, 11:14 am ~ I'm looking out my south facing window here in Fallbrook as long white lines are being painted across the sky from horizon to horizon, and asking why ?
Comment Profile ImageReally?
Comment #9 | Wednesday, Oct 3, 2012 at 7:10 pm
I’m going to pass up the opportunity to make fun of these people. They are simply malignant narcissists, viewing themselves as the hero of their own soap opera. These irrelevant emotional outbursts are only affect. Memo to hippies: Let me know when a tree answers you or a rock reproduces. Then go google CONTRAILS. Med Much?

I’m sorry, I tried to be light hearted about it and just couldn’t bring it off.
Comment Profile Imagestilljustwondering
Comment #10 | Wednesday, Oct 3, 2012 at 7:34 pm
MikeW..the article you posted is from commonsense CONSPIRACY.a journal not unlike the national enquirer for politicos...He travels extensivel out of the US..he just doesnt tell YOU his travel plans!!!
Comment Profile ImageTom Conley
Comment #11 | Thursday, Oct 4, 2012 at 12:37 pm
Mr. Monday - thanks for the epic response but I don't neeed your detailed explanation of the economy. Some people on the wicked right actually have a grasp of what's happening in the financial world.
Let me speak with some candor. I don't like Barak Hussein Obama. My reasons are legion but I will list just a few:
Anyone who claims on his inauguration that the ocean's tides will slow in rising and the planet will begin to heal is an egomaniac who thinks of himself as divinity. In fact, he's a cheap political hack who came out of the most corrupt political system in the country. His disgraceful tribute to Neil Armstrong and his constant crowing about how he so courageously took out OBL are testimony to my comment.
Appointing 30+ czars to his staff and the use of 900+ executive orders during his tenure are proof he doesn't want to deal with Congress.
His comments about our flag and national anthem indicate he doesn't really understand or support this country or its history. His comments about the military having to buy their own insurance indicates he doesn't know what the military is all about. His dismissive attitude towards Christians in this country indicates he doesn't know what his constituency is all about.
His comment about small business owners not building their businesses just confirms my suspicions.
I've seen him on TV telling his audience it's time to "reward our friends and punish our enemies". How can you deny that he's formenting class warfare??
His numerous multi-million dollar family vacations at a time when we're borrowing 40 cents of every dollar we spend is outrageous. He's squandering our national treasury.
I'll conclude by assring you that "Trickle -down government" has no future. Take a look at Greece, Spain, Portugal etc. if you don't believe me.
Comment Profile ImageMike W
Comment #12 | Thursday, Oct 4, 2012 at 1:35 pm
Comment 9 "I’m sorry, I tried to be light hearted about it and just couldn’t bring it off."

I understand completely, that's just how it is with the hopelessly closed minded. I suppose you didn't notice all the activity in the sky all day yesterday and into the night, probably didn't even look up all day, most people don't. Probably didn't get up early enough to see how we missed a beautiful summer sunrise this morning due to synthetic marine layer overcast and drastic temperature change from the previous days.
PS. Oh but I did Google contrails about two years ago when I started noticing these things and know perfectly what contrails are. I have noticed them way back when I was a kid. They are ice crystals formed from jet exhaust in cold temperature of the upper atmosphere that hang for a moment in the sky before evaporating after the airplane passes, just like the supersonic jets I observed as a kid. Ask any observer of the trails formed in the sky yesterday and you will find that these trails stay in the sky for hours and eventually fan out to form a haze that covers the whole sky and brings down the overall temperature, which might be great on sweltering days, if they were made from ice crystals rather than what they are made of, which eventually hit the ground, food crops and our lungs... How many of your friends suffer some sort of lung problems ?

@ Comment 10 ~ Just had to throw out the C word and I'm sure just seeing the word progressive sends you into a tailspin .. Do you suppose there were some who thought Thomas Paine wore a tin hat ?... Probably not but there were those who wanted to kill him and would have, had he not used a pin name

“These are the times that try men’s souls.” So wrote the famous Founding Father Thomas Paine in his historic pamphlet "Common Sense." Despite the fact that Mr. Paine’s activities were considered treasonous by England, and punishable by death, he bravely persisted. Like him we will speak truth to authority, have the courage of our convictions, and not be conned by the politicians. We are proud to name our magazine after the founder who asked the colonists to revolt against a foreign tyranny.

To each his own ... Peace
Comment Profile ImagePink
Comment #13 | Friday, Oct 5, 2012 at 8:54 am
In his ever continuing quest to be named "dumbest person on the planet" Al Gore blames Obama's poor performance in Thursday evening's presidential debate on the "altitude". Clearly Tipper should never allow him to leave the house without a keeper. I wonder though (if it is true that the altitude actually does affect Obama's mental process) how many of his really critical presidential errors in judgement were made while flying high above the clouds in Air Force One.
Comment Profile ImageMike W
Comment #14 | Friday, Oct 5, 2012 at 10:40 am
Jeez .. you are just so shallow Pink, when will you ever start practicing what you preach... your love of the Bible and Christ is just so superficial...

@ Tom Conley, "Anyone who claims on his inauguration that the ocean's tides will slow in rising and the planet will begin to heal is an egomaniac who thinks of himself as divinity.

I truly feel sorry for you man, you sir are a perfect example of the well educated dimwits who fail to understand there is another aspects of man, besides the physical and mental, you lack understanding in the natural sciences and especially quantum physics or you would know that it was from there that Obama made the above statement, and you too would know that when you stop poisoning the earth will begin to heal itself just like we do. Have you never watched a cut heal on your own body Tom ? As above so below

PS ... It's a pretty safe bet these days, that those who refer to Obama using his middle name are bigots ... "I don't like Barak Hussein Obama" Yeah and therein lies your problem Mr. Conley, you still believe it's all about the man, that the president is the leader without looking a little deeper to see that in the U.S., there are three industries that operate in a political and economic environment such that they can literally write their own ticket: the tentacular defense industry, the large financial and banking industry and the pivotal health industry.
Together, these industries account for more than forty percent of the U.S. economy. Their common characteristic is that suppliers can more or less create their own demand and fix prices accordingly. The potential for gouging is enormous. Needless to say, these industries are among the most profitable ones... for those who can enter them. The work that lies ahead then will be to shrink all of the above down to what they were in 1954. Romney says we need a strong defense, horse feathers.. There is no natural enemy of the American people, except the west's commercial system and their media who bombard us with propaganda while they bomb the heck out of poor people to clear the way for the industries mentioned above and it's been going on for a very long time.

In light of the fact that the American president is not the leader of America or the free world, there is no leader nor should there be one. The American president as well as all the other civil servants, who we call government, work not for the state, but for the American taxpayer and it is up to the American taxpayer to muster the cajones (ba**s) to make that clear to them, because as it stands now, we've got non-taxpaying big business calling the shots.. If you really want to get a grip then grab your representatives by the short hairs and remind them who they work for...
Comment Profile ImageTerry Leather
Comment #15 | Friday, Oct 5, 2012 at 11:54 am
Wednesday night, the bad economy finally got to a point where Obama felt the pain. Of course, he should be able to come back if he can fix four years of failure before the next debate. What I loved was That side-hug and back pat Obama got from Michelle after the debate. Back in my dating days, that meant “hey, thanks for taking me out but I'm getting tired...”

Romney on the other hand got the full frontal hug.
Comment Profile ImagePink
Comment #16 | Friday, Oct 5, 2012 at 1:19 pm
There you go again Mike W. You never let me down. Whenever I make a comment which you simply cannot refute you attack me in my faith. Re-reading my last comment I cannot find a thing which would make anyone think I'm a "bad" Christian or that I don't strive to follow the teachings of Christ. This is politics Mike, not religion, aren't they supposed to be kept separate? I didn't say anything about "hating" Al Gore, I just said he isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer, doesn't mean I don't like him. Interesting how you never accuse Redneck Bill of being shallow and un Christian when he attacks Bush or Jer or Jeff or whoever else he sometimes takes off on, guess that is because his beliefs are similar to yours. Just because we are Christians doesn't mean we are perfect. No one is. I'm sure you have some "quotes" from obscure people and a few whacky websites to recommend that we all read, so have a nice day.
Comment Profile ImageMike W
Comment #17 | Friday, Oct 5, 2012 at 4:17 pm
Hardly worth responding but ... No darling, politics and religion are much the same and it is politics and religion that should have no part in government. (I said that)
And about the rest of your comment, it is just your rather nasty and uncharitable remark about a man (two men) you do not know. And, by the way, every day you wake up in the morning, Al Gore is being proven to be right about global warming ~ Judge ye not ~ "dumbest person on the planet" ? Hmmm
Comment Profile ImageTerry Leather
Comment #18 | Friday, Oct 5, 2012 at 8:03 pm
A teleprompter.....a kingdom for a teleprompter!

Obama showed up for a conversation and Romney showed up with a chainsaw.
Comment Profile ImagePink
Comment #19 | Saturday, Oct 6, 2012 at 9:30 am
Geez Mike, who spit in your Wheaties? It is really interesting to me to see how someone who tries to make himself seem so urbane and knowledgeable can turn so mean when cornered. You go on and on about Bush being a criminal and not being able to leave the country because he would be arrested and hung by a world tribunal or something and then old Al puts his foot in his mouth (yet again) on coast to coast TV and the Worldwide Web, I point it out in jocular vein, and suddenly I'm the one who is being nasty and uncharitable? Seriously? Talk about "judge not". Have you got a mirror handy? Because if so you need to look in it friend. Redneck Bill and I don't agree politically but we respect each others view points, and on the whole I think he is a nice guy. It's okay to have different view points Mike, it really is. I rarely, if ever, agree with anything you say but I would stand up to anybody and defend your right to say it. If a Republican made the kind of dumb remark that Gore made you Liberals would be on it like a duck on a June bug and you know it. I'm pretty sure that President Obama didn't appreciate the altitude comment very much either. Made both he and Al look pretty silly. So go ahead, call me names, hit below the belt like all school yard bullies, I can take it. I turn the other cheek. It is a beautiful Saturday morning Mike, go out and enjoy it.
Comment Profile ImageStill Laughing
Comment #20 | Saturday, Oct 6, 2012 at 1:39 pm
I think mike W obviously has some anger management issues. I like reading the comments page and enjoy most of the bantering that goes back and forth between some of the "regulars" who contribute here. Pink has a terrific sense of humor, sometimes it is rapier sharp, sometimes droll, but there is never anything mean in it. Al Gore opened his mouth without connecting his brain first (yet again) and made both he and the president look ridiculous. That stuff goes viral Mike, did you really think nobody was going to have a good time with it? I mean the talk show hosts will dine out on the altitude did it for months! Why on earth you would attack Pink about her religious beliefs makes absolutely sense, and to call her nasty and uncharitable makes you look, well, nasty and uncharitable. I have to say it didn't make you look well Mike, you reacted like a 10 year old. Personal attacks really aren't very nice. I would also like to add that while I voted for Obama 4 years ago I won't be doing so again. He fooled me once, he won't be getting a second chance.
Comment Profile ImageLol
Comment #21 | Sunday, Oct 7, 2012 at 7:58 am
Taxing rich people will increase jobs by…crickets..crickets…

Is there actually any logic behind taxing the rich other than placating idiot whiners? “Oh, I know! To help the economy, let’s take money from people who know how to build wealth and give it to moron spenders in D.C.!”
Comment Profile ImageTom Conley
Comment #22 | Sunday, Oct 7, 2012 at 11:42 am
Mike W -
WOW! I thought all you "peace and love" mooks were taught you don't call someone names like "dimwit" and "racist" without knowing anything about them. I guess I overestimated you.
Very candidly - your lack of intellect is showing.
Ever heard of WWII? I ddin't think so. Next time you're close to a history book try to pick it up and thumb to the section on that war. In there you will learn that there were two countries at the time who were very much natural enemies of almost everyone else on the planet. You'll also hear the names of two courageous U.S. presidents who actually took world leadership roles and brought us out of the worst crisis this nation has ever faced.
Write me again when you've caught up!!
Comment Profile Imagejustwondering
Comment #23 | Sunday, Oct 7, 2012 at 3:49 pm
Love ya Pink..but Tipper LEFT Al Gore awhile back..hmmm...maybe THAt explains WHY AL GORE is so..well ..AL GORE!!! Ive got pop corn and a Bud waiting for the match up with Ol' Joe and Paul..Hope the altitude doesnt affect Ol 'Joe!!!
Comment Profile ImagePat
Comment #24 | Sunday, Oct 7, 2012 at 6:54 pm
The sad fact (for our country)is that Mr. Obama never was anything more than a well constructed marketing image -- no accomplishments of substance and his past hidden. He never should have been because in truth he never was. Sad.
Comment Profile ImagePink
Comment #25 | Sunday, Oct 7, 2012 at 8:49 pm
Sorry "justwondering" forgot Tipper had left old Al, guess that explains it.... I never let my husband leave the house without making sure his socks and shirt match (-: I too look forward to the match between Paul and Joe, it should be a cake walk unless they let Joe have cue cards, maybe they should hold this debate below sea level. Thank you "Still Laughing" for the kind words of support, I try to keep things light but Mike W tends to have a short fuse. By the way, were you making fun of me or quoting me with the (yet again) remark? I know I use it allot.... habit.
Comment Profile ImagePatti
Comment #26 | Wednesday, Oct 10, 2012 at 4:01 pm
"Are you better off now than you were 4 years ago?" Not for most of us. For most of us, Mr. Obama has added about many thousands per person of national debt. The unemployment rate is still horrific. We have a crumbling stock market and a moribund real estate market. As people have stated above, the national mood is awful.
Comment Profile Imagejustwondering
Comment #27 | Wednesday, Oct 10, 2012 at 6:27 pm
SUPRISE!!Today the Administration admits that the murder of our Ambass. and 4 others in Libya on SEPT 11 was indeed a terrorist attack..yet during the first 10 days following the murders,the administration BLAMED them on a video that frankly no one has seen!! Only after the persistence of Darryl Issas committe has the TRUTH come out..Barack Husein Obama went on Letterman*(remember he was terribly doing entertainment shows that week including the View) when he denied to us..the people who write his paycheck that it was not terrorists!! he never said"We dont know" or "we will find the truth" no..he was quick to blame them on some video..he should be fired for LYING to the American people..can you imagine Mike Ws reaction when he realizes hes been duped these past 4 years??Or mr Monday who still stands behind this "Oh..I was being polite to Mitt during the debate thats why I was totally unable to defend anything ive done the past 4 years" president..and the advertisement that Obama has now regarding big Bird and the Romney campagn..really??is that all they have??In these times of no money..increased debt..TERRORIST ATTACKS>>a man getting off a plane today with an arsenol...thats all they can do??Fill 15 seconds of BIG be totally ashamed if I was on BARACK HUSEIN OBAMAS team right now because obviously hes not taking this very seriously...

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